The Non-uniform Continuity Problem On The Numerical Simulation of a Dust-storm Case Over East Asia Article (PDF Available) in Procedia Engineering 15:4476-4479 December 2011 with 22 Reads. Review: PRO-3 Leslie Simulator by Mark Longo. Following are facts and some subjective impressions about the Motion Sound PRO-3 Leslie Simulator, which I have owned and used for many months. I use the PRO-3 with my Hammond-Suzuki XB-2 in a live performance setting of mostly small to medium sized night clubs.
As for my take on the subject.Note: I have played the CX-3 extensively, and the C1 and XK-3 (NOT the XK-3C) briefly. The rest of my opinions are based on various clips that I have heard and should be taken with a grain of salt.Hammond XK-3C: The best organ sound of the hardware clonewheels, and the most adjustable by far. The tube preamp is also a nice touch. However, the Leslie sim still appears to be trailing the pack, even in the XK-3C (though again, I haven't heard it in person).Nord C1: This might have been a winner if it had had the adjustability of the Hammond and Korg, as both the organ and Leslie sounds are within tweakable distance of what I'm looking for from a sim. Without the ability to fine tune things, however, the organ is just too thin and wimpy while the Leslie is too fast and phasey. A shame, really, as the Nord probably comes closer than either the Hammond or the Korg to getting both areas right, but in the end it achieves neither.Korg CX-3: Still the best Leslie sim out there (in hardware format, at least), but the organ sound lacks realism compared to the Hammond and Nord.VB3: Based on the few clips I've been able to find, it seems to have an excellent jazz sound and Leslie sim.
I'd like to hear it in more of a rock context, however, to see if it has the balls and cut for screaming solo work.B4II: From the numerous clips I've heard, it just doesn't compare to VB3 in terms of realism.Overall: I'd have to hear it played in a rock context to give a final determination, but what little I've heard of VB3 has been very impressive. Depending on how its organ sound holds up in more aggressive situations, either VB3 by itself (triggered by an appropriate controller) or the XK-3C through the VB3's Leslie sim might be the way to go.Re: Hardware vs. Sotware B-3/Leslie simulations01/25/09 08:26 PM. As for my take on the subject.Note: I have played the CX-3 extensively, and the C1 and XK-3 (NOT the XK-3C) briefly. The rest of my opinions are based on various clips that I have heard and should be taken with a grain of salt.Hammond XK-3C: The best organ sound of the hardware clonewheels, and the most adjustable by far.
The tube preamp is also a nice touch. However, the Leslie sim still appears to be trailing the pack, even in the XK-3C (though again, I haven't heard it in person).Nord C1: This might have been a winner if it had had the adjustability of the Hammond and Korg, as both the organ and Leslie sounds are within tweakable distance of what I'm looking for from a sim.
Without the ability to fine tune things, however, the organ is just too thin and wimpy while the Leslie is too fast and phasey. A shame, really, as the Nord probably comes closer than either the Hammond or the Korg to getting both areas right, but in the end it achieves neither.Korg CX-3: Still the best Leslie sim out there (in hardware format, at least), but the organ sound lacks realism compared to the Hammond and Nord.VB3: Based on the few clips I've been able to find, it seems to have an excellent jazz sound and Leslie sim. I'd like to hear it in more of a rock context, however, to see if it has the balls and cut for screaming solo work.B4II: From the numerous clips I've heard, it just doesn't compare to VB3 in terms of realism.Overall: I'd have to hear it played in a rock context to give a final determination, but what little I've heard of VB3 has been very impressive. Depending on how its organ sound holds up in more aggressive situations, either VB3 by itself (triggered by an appropriate controller) or the XK-3C through the VB3's Leslie sim might be the way to go.So you have not heard the XK-3C in person so how can you really know? Any thoughts as to how the software emulations compare soundwise to the hardware clonewheels? Looking at what seem to be the consensus best in each category (Hammond XK-3C, Genuine Soundware VB3), how do they measure up?I think you need a lot more people's opinion before claiming a perceived consensus.
I would put the B4II way over the VB3. In my view VB3 is weak on the upper register for cut and has no single-tone.s especially off-scanner and needs work imo. HOWEVER, having excellent potential. I need a lot of cut of single note runs.
The B4II can scream.My favorite in the past and still remains strong has also been the EVB3 but.only. using a Leslie (awesome! And soulfull scanner). I have never liked the EVB3 rotor sim with it's colorizations or peaks and notches perceived by the developer cabinet ambiance, why they have a 'dry' option to those it offends. (dry to spin).Perceived sound on a clone has a lot to do with the the capability and 'ear' of the owner to tweak it.
I am actually only recently enthusiastic about the B4II having found the right cabinet and tweak. As far as VaseIII: there is argument that sample-based tone may sound great but can wear the listener down faster, ultimately creating less interest than fully-modeled-based tone that can be more random and gives more 'changeup' to the listening ear. VaseIII is playing loops. Obviously, a matter of personal choice that is always said with these threads.Re: Hardware vs. Sotware B-3/Leslie simulations01/26/09 03:34 PM. I think you need a lot more people's opinion before claiming a perceived consensus. I would put the B4II way over the VB3.
In my view VB3 is weak on the upper register for cut and has no single-tone.s especially off-scanner and needs work imo. HOWEVER, having excellent potential. I need a lot of cut of single note runs. The B4II can scream.Agreed, there will never be consensus. Those people not experienced in Hammonds have no frame of reference, while those people VERY experienced in Hammonds will still have a wide opinion of what is authentic or good sounding, because real Hammonds sound so drastically different from each other.I have the exact opposite opinion, for example. To me, VB3 kills B4II.
You have to use the C model tonewheel set to get the proper keyboard balance to get it to punch the upper register. Leslie sim is one of the best there is, hardware or software.I used B4II in a session and the distortion really bothered me. I couldn't dial it down far enough, and the tone of the entire thing just wasn't that authentic.
Those people not experienced in Hammonds have no frame of reference, while those people VERY experienced in Hammonds will still have a wide opinion of what is authentic or good sounding, because real Hammonds sound so drastically different from each other.That's why I love EVB3 in Logic so much over any other software clone - the thing is so darn tweakable that you can dial in your idea of the ideal Hammond organ. No other software organ that I've seen is anywhere near as programmable/configurable. I used B4II in a session and the distortion really bothered me. I couldn't dial it down far enough, and the tone of the entire thing just wasn't that authenticThese are the variables of what computer, what soundcard, what cabinet and what audio path, what sound reinforcement (if no Leslie) and why opinions differ.The B4II configuration I run has.no.
distortion unless I crank up the drive. The B4II.is.
a digital 'B3' in my view. This is not to criticize your view as we all can hear and look for different things. About Beatrix: I believe that last upgrade that reportedly the developer worked on for 2 years or more (from what I read) is obviously unavailable, proprietary and is the KeyB sound engine.
![Leslie Simulation G-system Leslie Simulation G-system](http://www.sweetwater.com/images/dynamic/LesliePed/original-300.jpg)
(correction welcome). It would seem to me that one would have to put an equal amount of time in the old Beatrix for similar results - an impression - though perhaps not. I wrote before I think, I have had both running simultaneously into my Mackie board with simple pulling up attenuators to hear the B4II vs VB3 - the B4II gobbled it up. Obviously, these are just words and really a person would have to hear in-person to be convinced or not convinced. (I am familiar with the 'C' organ)I think we can agreeably disagree and be happy in what we perceive to be best.
That is what it is all about. Bottom line is: playing skill of the artist actually is the 'ultimate clone' - has a far greater margin of difference than what product using the latest clones, that one could argue are close in quality. I am impressed with the C1 also, I would like to try my Doepfer drawbar controller on one if I pick one up for an ultra-lightweight.Re: Hardware vs. Sotware B-3/Leslie simulations01/26/09 06:52 PM.
Agreed, there will never be consensus. Those people not experienced in Hammonds have no frame of reference, while those people VERY experienced in Hammonds will still have a wide opinion of what is authentic or good sounding, because real Hammonds sound so drastically different from each other.Not to mention that the question can be interpreted either as one question (what is the best b3/leslie simulation), or two questions (what is the best b3 simulation, and what is the best leslie simulation). Ask a question like this and you'll get a mixture of answers to either or both questions, making the whole thing kind of un-clear.Re: Hardware vs.
Sotware B-3/Leslie simulations01/26/09 07:21 PM. Not to mention that the question can be interpreted either as one question (what is the best b3/leslie simulation), or two questions (what is the best b3 simulation, and what is the best leslie simulation). Ask a question like this and you'll get a mixture of answers to either or both questions, making the whole thing kind of un-clear.Just to clarify the intent of the original post, I am referring to the best B-3/Leslie combined simulation. However, since VB3's Leslie effect can apparently be used independently of its organ sound (though I couldn't find this feature documented anywhere on the official website), I included this in several poll options.Re: Hardware vs. Sotware B-3/Leslie simulations01/26/09 09:33 PM. That's why I love EVB3 in Logic so much over any other software clone - the thing is so darn tweakable that you can dial in your idea of the ideal Hammond organ. No other software organ that I've seen is anywhere near as programmable/configurableI have to agree here too,- I´m not a Logic user but had to play organ stuff in a commercial recording session in a friends studio.
He had Logic 8.x and I had to use the EVB3. From the presets side, I wasn´t satisfied w/ the sounds and I started tweaking, especially the ramp up/down for the treble and bass rotors and the mic distances,- and after some minutes, I found the perfect sound for that tune to record.It ended w/ a very satisfying result and it was fun to play this software clone.It´s sad, it´s only available in Logic itself and not a VST.A.C.Re: Hardware vs. Sotware B-3/Leslie simulations01/26/09 11:35 PM.
I have to agree here,- actually, VB3 is better than B4II by a)better distortion,I don't want distortion just natural drive like the original that the B4II does very well. I use distortion through a preamp with the correct tube driving the distortion not software when rarely used. Most of the time I don't want it.
b) issue of B4II depending on 1'drawbar w/ percussion 'on' (B4II doesn´t store this optional setting which is an annoying bug since 2 years),I don't have that problem because the HC does not use the patch system but the board-configured preset system with one patch. Though it can be used. Using the 1' stays faithful actually to the original for percussion unless it was modified. (the original) c) missing low end in B4II,That was the problem with the B41 that I criticized all the time that needed EQing. Not a problem with the B4II.
I discussed that problem with Michael Kurz of NI before the B4II came out and complained about it. Thusly, stopping using the B41 and using only the EVB3 for software. B4II with the correct audio setup has amazing bass, imho.d) level probs across the keyboard w/ several amp models.I have read this before. I don't get this at all.
The vintage Hammond does not sound the same with each key because of tones going into different filter capacitors. A sample of an organ instead of a modeled instrument would likely be perfectly balanced but would sound artificial, weak and not authentic. I don't want perfectly balanced. My setup has an excellent vintage balance. So many variable with software that it is evident that some get different results/sound that is quite mystifying to me.About the EVB3: that has the worst rotor sim of all the clones in my opinion. The sim takes, unless carefully tweaked a significant amount of the tone. All you need to do is compare the dry sound to the cabinet sound of the sim.
I never run the EVB3 without a Leslie - it just sucks - while with a Leslie it is a freakin' knockout. Of course, this is my opinion of what I perceive for the sound I want. I discussed this with the developer who later added the dry to spin for this perceived problem. (my suggestion if I humbly say)Re: Hardware vs.
Sotware B-3/Leslie simulations01/27/09 01:30 AM. I voted VB3, with the caveat of having not really worked with any of the hardware clones. I've played the NE2 in stores and liked it a lot, and would love a dual manual XK-3 setup. I've played real B3's, but it's been about 15 years, so I don't really have a direct comparison.I do, however, own VB3, B4-II and Logic's EVB3, and, while they all have their good points, I think VB3 is the one that makes me feel like I'm really playing a Hammond. B4-II just sounds too dry for me, and the distortion sounds way too transistor. I do love the transistor organ models in B4, though. And the interface and programmability of B4 are about the best of any of the software clones.
I just wish I liked the sound better. EVB3 doesn't have quite the richness I'm looking for, though I like it better than B4, plus, my laptop is Windows, so that puts it out of the running for live use. VB-3's jazz sounds just nail it for me, they are fuzzy and warm, but not brittle, and have the grunginess I've always associated with a B3/leslie combo. I like a little bit of drive.
The VB3 leslie is the best of all the sims, to me it sounds nearly convincing on slow, but the fast setting doesn't quite do it for me, though it's closer than B4 or EVB3. I also really like the 1 controller for Fast/Stop/Slow. VB3 doesn't quite have the programmability of B4, and it seems to use a bit more CPU per instance than B4, at least on my machine, hosted in Ableton Live. The top octave doesn't quite cut it for me, it seems thin and bitey instead of screaming to me, but I haven't tried the C tonewheels as suggested by Mr. Stubbs above.
I guess the best thing I can say is that I gig a fair amount with VB3, and I get a ton of compliments on how good my organ sounds are. B4-II just sounds too dry for meIIn my opinion (one of many):Bingo! To get cut especially single-tone cut you need a clone balanced between colorization peaks and notches programed in to simulate a lesle speaker and the dry sound. Different clones are programmed in either direction and obviously virtual mic placement etc can offer different options.Anyone can do this. Take the clone with the rotor sim and alternate between dry and rotor sim. You will here an absolute diminishment in tone as the DSP developer has tried to take the tone and make it sound like it is coming out of a wood or other Leslie.Trouble is.
When a real Hammond vintage tonewheel sends the signal to the Leslie.it is a full-bodied tone. without the said diminishment of colorization peaks and notches in the non-spin mode that evens out in the spin mode.
The REAL Leslie speaker (other than the normal tube drive and ambience) does not diminish or reduce the properties of the full bodied tone by spinning to create an artificial perception of such physical spin by a simulator=full tone and cut. Crossfading from spin into dry (brake mode) is one option that the EVB3 tried to solve this dilemma, imo. Therefore using a simulator=more cut as it approaches dry in the non spin state. (brake)This is why many people hate rotor sims. There is a percentage of tone loss. The sim will absolutely diminish the tone. For ultimate cut and for the sound to be not blanketed, imho, the sim HAS to.favor.
![Leslie Simulation G-system Leslie Simulation G-system](/uploads/1/2/5/5/125565205/455499553.jpg)
the dry sound with an good/acceptable/nice spin but not a heavily programmed spin. This is the way the B4II is programed. Now for those that just play backup chords most of the time or all the time or pushing heavily driven chords. It is not so much a problem or absolutely no problem. Simulator cabinet choices also effect the ratio of closer to dry vs more artificial programming of a virtual Leslie cabinet effect, obviously.